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Post by Darth Ski'rata on Feb 7, 2007 0:57:38 GMT -5
Had the battle been the other way with Vader on the high ground there would be no discussion. A sith would have ended him then and there. Without question and without remorse. That shows the weak will of the Jedi. Unable to carry thru once emotions become involved. Oh and Shingo. Wanna let it burn, wanna wanna let it burn. [glow=red,2,300]I agree a jedi get to much into feelings and wont kill their loved ones or people they know for a long time[/glow] |
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Post by kensho on Feb 7, 2007 0:59:47 GMT -5
There is no question that some of the Jedi Philosophies are flawed.We live in a Grey world,Not black and white.So it's a tuff question.Both philosophies are flawed.And If we thinking it through,the Jedi were wrong to think Anakin couldn't be redeemed. Also not to help him and let him burn,that was low very un-ethical.And in the end it was Luke that believing that there was good in him that saved Anakin.I read the Book Starwars and Philosophy they talk about alot of this.If this interests you then check it out in the books section. This is Aeon Kensho I am having log in problems,so sorry  |
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Post by jerrekdromas on Feb 7, 2007 1:04:53 GMT -5
Had the battle been the other way with Vader on the high ground there would be no discussion. A sith would have ended him then and there. Without question and without remorse. That shows the weak will of the Jedi. Unable to carry thru once emotions become involved. Oh and Shingo. Wanna let it burn, wanna wanna let it burn. [glow=red,2,300]I agree a jedi get to much into feelings and wont kill their loved ones or people they know for a long time[/glow] Would you? I think that even some of the Sith would be pained by having to kill someone that they had trained and/or been on a lot of missions with. A Sith gets his/her power from anger and EMOTION how could they not feel any if that is true? |
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Red Five
Jedi Knight
"My daddy can whoop your daddy!" -Luke Skywalker
Posts: 162
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Post by Red Five on Feb 7, 2007 2:00:18 GMT -5
I've heard it put this way before. Obi-Wan believed in the prohpecy..."You were the chosen one! It was said that you would destroy the sith not join them. Bring balance to the Force not leave it in darkness...you were my brother Anakin. I loved you!"...so he could not just kill what the Force had possible sent to bring balance, therefore he left Anakin's life, whether he lived or died, up to the will of the Force.
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Darth Revan
Jedi Master
{S=2}
May The Dark Side Overwhelm You
Posts: 499
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Post by Darth Revan on Feb 7, 2007 3:20:13 GMT -5
I've heard it put this way before. Obi-Wan believed in the prohpecy..."You were the chosen one! It was said that you would destroy the sith not join them. Bring balance to the Force not leave it in darkness...you were my brother Anakin. I loved you!"...so he could not just kill what the Force had possible sent to bring balance, therefore he left Anakin's life, whether he lived or died, up to the will of the Force. Yea Anakin had to survive since he was the chosen one |
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Post by bloodthirstysith on Feb 7, 2007 12:00:53 GMT -5
It was never clearly stated that he was the chosen one for the lightside. Or the darkside for that matter. All that was stated was that he was the Chosen One. Even Yoda had stated that the prohecy could have been read wrong.
Anakin is the balance of force, having been in the light and flung so far deep into the darkside. Then redeemed himself. That is the balance. It applies to life as well.
But as for the fight. Obi-wan kicked his Sith a@$ all over Mustafar
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Darth Shivilow™
Jedi Master
Myspace is where I have been but now I'm back to rp!Tuesday&Thursday is the only time I can get on.
Posts: 2,059
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Post by Darth Shivilow™ on Feb 7, 2007 12:37:19 GMT -5
Yeah but don't you forget who owns Obi-Wan in a new hope and its clearly Vader won. I know many of yall say oh he just gave him self to the force but you all mistake that Obi-wan is weak.
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Post by jerrekdromas on Feb 7, 2007 12:42:12 GMT -5
Obi-Wan and weak should never be used in the same sentence. He was strong until the end and his death had purpose that wasn't Vader beating him it was the way that he wanted it to end. He played him like a fiddle.  |
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Darth Shivilow™
Jedi Master
Myspace is where I have been but now I'm back to rp!Tuesday&Thursday is the only time I can get on.
Posts: 2,059
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Post by Darth Shivilow™ on Feb 7, 2007 12:53:43 GMT -5
So your saying that he played Vader like a fiddle and if Obi-wan wanted to defeat him he would have. Then i press this question to you then why didn't he finish him on mudusfar.
P.S i know i miss spell it i'm so horrible with spelling these star wars planets.
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Post by jerrekdromas on Feb 7, 2007 13:13:36 GMT -5
I think that it hurt Obi-Wan to even fight Anakin. He loved him like his brother and no one with any sanity would kill their own brother. He was defending himself.
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Post by Jayman87 on Feb 7, 2007 13:54:33 GMT -5
The Jedi thought that Anakin couldn't be redeemed? Need I remind you that Obi-Wan attempted that very feat at the beginning of the battle?
Anakin was having none of it as he got it in his head that Obi-Wan had a romantic interest in Padme. Sure Yoda said that Anakin must be killed, but it can be inferred that he realized the extent of Anakin's corruption at this point. And again, Anakin used the Force and his will to survive to douse the flames and cling on to life.
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Red Five
Jedi Knight
"My daddy can whoop your daddy!" -Luke Skywalker
Posts: 162
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Post by Red Five on Feb 7, 2007 16:06:33 GMT -5
Darth Vader vs. "Ben" Kenobi
Here is a movie quote that sums it up.
DV "Obi-Wan is here. The Force is with him."
Grand Moff Tarkin "If you are right, he must not be allowed to escape."
DV "Escape is not his plan. I must face him alone."
"I've been waiting for you Obi-Wan. We meet again at last. The circle is now complete when I left you I was but the learner now I am the master."
"Only a master of evil Darth."
"Your powers are weak old man."
"You can't win Darth, if you strike me down I shall become more powerful than you can possible imagine."
"You should not have come back!"
Through his own death Obi-Wan was able to make Luke take his place, and he was able to still train and guide Luke. So by dying Obi-Wan didn't loose anything. He was able to fulfill the reason he had been a hermit all those years on Tatooine through his death, to teach Luke about the Force and turn him into a Jedi. It was never Obi-Wan's plan to escape.
Through the tragedy of Obi-Wan dying at the hands of Darth Vader along with being told Vader murdered his father, Luke now had only one path, learn the Force, become a Jedi, and destroy the Empire. Obi-Wan's death was necessary because it sealed Luke's fate to becoming more than just a great fighter pilot.
Luke was now on a path that would have him taking on the Empire. Something I don't believe he would have done if Obi-Wan was alive. It would have been like "Why aren't you taking on Darth Vader? Why me?". Luke now lived for Obi-Wan, so he had to confront Darth Vader for Obi-Wan. Eventually Luke would fight Darth Vader for his friends in ESB, and finally for his sister in ROTJ because of the possibility of Vader converting his sister to the Dark Side.
Tragedy or even the possibility of tragedy was always the driving force for Luke to fight. In ANH Luke started his journey only after his uncle and aunt were murdered by the Empire.
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Lord Brama
Jedi Master
{S=19}
Fear. Fear attracts the fearful, the strong, the weak, the innocent, the corrupt. Fear is my ally.
Posts: 1,969
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Post by Lord Brama on Feb 7, 2007 17:32:06 GMT -5
Red Five, I am speechless after that. Very well thought out and put. Well almost speechless.  So it seems that the common theme that lead Luke on his path was revenge. For his Aunt and Uncle and for Obi as well. After his training with Yoda and the abbarition of Obi, it was then he was lead by Truth and Justice for his friends and his sister. Just a thought. |
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Darth Shivilow™
Jedi Master
Myspace is where I have been but now I'm back to rp!Tuesday&Thursday is the only time I can get on.
Posts: 2,059
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Post by Darth Shivilow™ on Feb 7, 2007 18:02:38 GMT -5
I would also like to point out that Luke didn't want to fight his father once he knew Vader was his father. It was only because he didn't want his sister turn to the Darkside that he faught his own father and it was a grate fight seen.
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Lord Brama
Jedi Master
{S=19}
Fear. Fear attracts the fearful, the strong, the weak, the innocent, the corrupt. Fear is my ally.
Posts: 1,969
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Post by Lord Brama on Feb 7, 2007 18:08:47 GMT -5
Yes it was a great fight scene. That is not what is in question. The statement falls into the start of Luke's path. Which really should be in the ANH thread.
So back to the Anakin/Obi fight.
Being a Sith I would have killed Obi, no matter of the past feelings I felt for him. Keep in mind that Anakin's anger towards Obi had already grown way before Anakin embracing the Dark Side. Anakin would have let him burn, In my eyes anyway.
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